Pet hates

[sophie]

Hi everyone. I was just thinking to myself, and wondering what everyone gets annoyed about regarding vegan issues.
I mean, one of my biggest things that annoys me is what I've already discussed in the forums, and that is people who call themselves vegan but then eat something totally unvegan, or even un-vegetarian!
Another thing that bugs me- is when people offer you something to eat and they say "it's NEARLY vegan, it just has a little bit of butter in it" :confused:
Anyone else have a pet hate?

[Erin Pavlina]

I hate it when my mom says, "Oh, you can just order a salad." everywhere we go.

I hate it when people say, "It's vegan except it has a little bit of milk in it." Just like you Sophie.

I hate it when restaurants put a vegan patty on a non-vegan bun. Lordy. They were so close!

[Maggie]

"But what do you EAT?" - like the world of animal-free food consists of nothing more than iceberg lettuce.

"Fish aren't animals." - do they look like plants to you?

"But the cow would blow up if no one milked her!" - I'm a female mammal and I certainly don't need a stranger of a different species to milk me!

"Can't you just pick the meat out?" - oh, there's just a little bit of (cat, Uncle Jim, etc.) in it. Can't you just pick it out?

Peace,
Maggie

[CarlaJ]

I just heard this yesterday:

"How can you be vegan if you don't like olives?"

and by the same person..

"I'd like to be a vegetarian, but I'm allergic to mushrooms."

heard yesterday by a different person:

"at least your not a psycho vegan."

[Erin Pavlina]

Maggie, those are great!

I learned this one years ago and it works everytime:

When a waiter brings me something that has meat in it and says, "Well can't you just pick it out?" I reply, "Would you pick dog poop out of your salad and eat it?" They take it right away.

[sophie]

another one I hate is "but how do you get your iron/ calcium/ protein (etc) ?"

[Erin Pavlina]

When people say, "How do you get enough protein?" I now say, "How do you avoid getting too much?" Makes them think for a second.

[Sylver]

Hello! One thing that bothers me is to see a product that says 'no animal testing' but the ingredients actually has animal ingredients in it. It's like they're saying they care about animals, but that it's okay to have (as my dd says) 'dead animals' in it. How's that caring for animals???!! Well, they can't fool me! Bugs me to bits!
Take care!

[5xblessed]

I'm definetly remembering the dog poo line. Perfect! My pet hates..."But kids NEED meat, milk, eggs, etc" or I heard this one "Your kids won't have enough energy to keep up." Huh? Have they met my kids? LOL
Lisa

[Robin]

I get "WHAT do you EAT!?" on a weekly basis. I usually respond, "What do you think I eat?" And they say "Fruits and vegetables?" at which point I go on to tell them that I eat crepes, pancakes, bagels, pasta, rice, veggie burgers, soy yoghurt, burritos, tofu... I could go on for quite awhile. Or I respond "Well, what do YOU eat?" and they'll say something like hamburgers or ice cream, etc. and I'll say "So do I!" and name the vegan equivalent (veggie/grain/soy burgers, soy ice cream/fruit sorbet, etc.)

I also get, "But if we didn't eat animals there would be too many to feed or care for and they'd die anyway." Umm, like we're going to have a cow overpopulation problem? So I usually go into a monologue about artificial insemination and mass breeding operations and that usually "shoots down" that debate.

I also get the fish comment, to which I respond that there are two categories of living things/beings consumed by humans: plants or animals. Since when is a fish a plant??

And lastly I get "Where do you get calcium/protein?" (Usually referring to dairy) and I have to explain that fortified soymilk has the same nutrients as cow's milk.

Sometimes I'll get crazy questions like "If a bug flew into your mouth and you swallowed it would that be unvegan?"

:rolleyes:

Sorry about the loooong post!

[sophie]

I hate that "what do you eat?" thing too.
Another thing I hate (oh there are so many!:p ) is when a complete stranger asks you why you are vegan, and you don't know this person from a bar of soap, and have no inclination to discuss your personal choices with them (it sort of depends HOW they ask), and so you try to put it simply for them, and then they start trying to have an argument with you that you don't even want, and they pull out all the classics like "well, vegetables feel pain when they get pulled out of the ground". Oh please. Actually, I remember my little sister trying that argument on me when she was younger, I remind her of it sometimes, and she gets embarressed because she's vegan now!
Also, once my father-in-law said to me when we were staying, "Jasper has cows milk though, doesn't he?" (Jasper was one year old at the time), and I said "no, he's vegan, like us", and He replied "well, don't you think you should wait till he's old enough to make his own choice?" Excuuuuuse me? So we're supposed to give him a different diet from us, and one we don't agree with, till he's "old enough to make a choice"? What crazy logic is that?:confused:

[Maggie]

What about the fact that the Beauty Without Cruelty cosmetics line now has some non-vegan items (containing silk protein)?

Why don't they just rename themselves "Beauty With Just a Little Cruelty"?

Peace,
Maggie

[Robin]

I didn't know that about BWC!! Even vegan companies are compromising?! That's terrible! I decided to send them an email (if anyone else wants to, it's info@avalonnaturalproducts.com) Here's what I wrote:

I recently learned via a message board that some of the products in your Beauty Without Cruelty line contain silk protein. I am a vegan who is outraged by this. I will not support your company if this is how you "respect" animal-friendly ideals. You have six other product lines in which to use silk protein and other cruel animal byproducts if you really find it necessary, but I can't believe that you would put it into your one "cruelty-free" product line. Please don't compromise like this. I hope you will stop using silk immediately in your BWC line and become a dependable source of real cruelty-free products. A response would be appreciated.

[Robin]

This is the email I received in response to mine, regarding the addition of silk protein (and, I learned, keratin) to some BWC products.

Dear Robin,

Thank you for your interest in Avalon Natural Products and for your inquiry regarding Beauty Without Cruelty Colour Cosmetics.

Founded in 1963 with the strongest criteria on animal testing and within the vegetarian ethic, Beauty Without Cruelty Cosmetics became the leading name in alternative beauty care for intelligent, responsible and compassionate individuals. Dedicated to a business philosophy that advances animal welfare, BWC stood consistently against animal testing and pioneered a powerful ethical standard that could eliminate animal testing for cosmetic purposes globally.

Beauty Without Cruelty Colour Cosmetics are developed and manufactured in England, and recently underwent a change in management. As we are U.S.A. distributors only, Avalon Natural Products is unfortunately not responsible for decisions involved in new colour cosmetic formulations. Our relationship with Beauty Without Cruelty was built on the principles on which the company was founded and has been dedicated to for over three decades.

We too are concerned about the addition of silk protein and keratin. Both silk protein and keratin are cruelty-free animal-derived ingredients. Silk protein comes from the discarded silkworm cocoons, once the moths have hatched and results in no harm to silkworms. BWC England has added this ingredient to the Eyeshadows, Moisturising Makeup and Waterproof Mascara only. Keratin has been added to the Clear Mascara only, and comes from sheared sheep's wool with no harm occurring the animal.

All other cosmetics within the BWC range are vegan, containing no animal-derived ingredients. Be assured, our every effort is to restore the ethical parameters of BWC and to reject the use of animal-derived ingredients. We appreciate your letter of concern, and will include it in our appeal to England.

To learn more about our family of products, please visit us online at www.avalonorganics.com. Our interactive and informative web site offers a comprehensive resource and reference guide of our products, ingredients, and our inspiration, combined with the convenience of online shopping.

Kindest regards,

Abby Walker

Avalon Natural Products
www.avalonorganics.com

[Erin Pavlina]

Katharina, just say, "Well I'm also choosing not to feed him beer and wine. Should I give him alcohol until he's old enough to decide for himself how he wants to live?"

or, if that's too strong, you could say, "I'm choosing not to feed him chocolate covered crickets, and I hear that's a delicacy in many places. So am I depriving him by making this choice for him? Or monkey brains, or frog's legs, etc. etc."

[Blinky]

I hate it when non vegans avoid sitting with us at dinner gatherings. What do they think we're going to do? Give them a lecture. Take their plate.

I also hate it when non-vegans think that we are somehow suffering. That is so untrue. Not only do I feel so much better, physically and spiritually, but I love the foods we eat.

The nice thing about veganism is that it introduced me to so many different types of food and recipes that I would have never thought of trying as a ominvore. I think most people go day in and day out having the same boring stuff - not trying anything new. They are the ones suffering.

One last thing I hate is when people won't try something I made just because it is vegan. Like it has to have beef lard in it before it is considered food. A potato is vegan and they eat that. I sometimes think it is just to be spiteful. What a waste of energy.

Thanks for the chance to vent I am as good as new.

[Erin Pavlina]

Roxanne, yeah, I hate it when people say, "I don't like vegan food." I say, "Oh, so you never eat fruits and vegetables?" And they say, "Well, yeah, I mean, of course, I eat those." And I say, "Well those are vegan? Watch out, you're halfway there."

They get very unnerved.

Oh and I love it when people see me eating potato chips or french fries and they say, "Those are vegan?" They obviously think vegan means all health food. I tell them, "Yeah, why would you think they wouldn't be?"

They get all flustered. But some are really surprised that we can eat junk food.

[Blinky]

Yeah, your right.. They think every meal is a plate of lettuce, celery, and carrots. LOL! As much as I love vegetables, I woulldn't last long eating just that. :D

[VeganMonster]

I also hate the 'what do you eat' question. So stupid, especially when they see me eating.
Another one that gets on my nerves, though I'm not sure anyone else has heard this one. A acquentince of mine who is a meat eater ALWAYS insists on telling me how to be a vegan. Like what foods I can and can't eat. I love it when I lash back with well you CAN'T eat meat!

[sophie]

I just remembered something else which is sort of a pet hate.
When my partner used to go home for holidays (before we were together), his family was very unsupportive of his veganism. They would cook dinner with no thought for him, just give him a potato and salad or whatever part of the meaty meal he could eat. So he would cook for himself, and offer to cook for everyone but they would decline, they still can't understand us.
My parents have always been great, and when I have a meal at home they always make vegan for everybody.
Also, this year I was in hospital with asthma, and the meals I got were absolutely disgusting (and I'm not even a fussy eater!), it was as though the kitchen were annoyed with me for putting them out, so threw together whatever gross combination of stuff they had at hand. For example, one night I had rubbery rice mixed with oily half-cooked peanuts and walnuts, a huge plateful of the stuff, with NO seasoning whatsoever!
Another time it was a plateful of mushy boiled cabbage, carrot and potato, again no seasoning, and yet another time it was rubbery noodles with boiled carrots on top. UGH! They're lucky I didn't leave sicker than when I came in. Luckily my family brought me in loads of good vegan food or I would have starved:p

[Mystican]

I'm also enjoying reading everyone's responses. There's some humorous relief that comes with sharing frustration :)

One thing that bugs me is when I'm online chatting with friends and the topic of food comes up, what we think is good or what we've had recently to eat or what we're going to have for our next meal... and I maybe mention something like tofu eggless salad ... and I hear a bunch of "ewwwws" in reply. Grrr.... I mean, I looove tofu eggless salad... they've never even tried it, and here they are acting all grossed out about something the taste of which they haven't the foggiest idea? And then they'll be going on and on (especially with the holidays and associated feasts coming up) about turkey or chicken or steaks or something like that, and I don't want to act grossed out or say "ewwww" (even though I feel like doing that) because I don't want to seem rude or "intolerant." :mad: Well WHY DO WE ALWAYS HAVE TO BE THE TOLERANT ONES?!?

... Sorry. Just had to get that off the proverbial chest. ;) But seriously, why does it always seem like so many people find the very idea of a vegan food like soy or tofu "gross"? :confused: *sighs* :rolleyes:

Another thing I dislike is when I'm in a restaurant and the well-meaning waiter or waitress will start rattling off the specials of the day, or make recommendations from the menu... all of which inevitably have chicken, or fish, or meat of some sort.

And... one of the biggest annoyances I find as a vegan living in a largely non-vegan world is... television. I don't really watch T.V. much, but just once, I would like to sit back and relax and watch an evening of television that doesn't have ads for some new "delicious" "savory" or "mouth-watering" meat-filled food that I've just *got* to try... :rolleyes: Would love to see the day when I can watch tv and be interrupted not by an ad promoting some new burger or taco at McDonald's, Carl's Jr., Burger King, or Taco Bell.... but by an ad promoting the delectable new burger at <insert imaginary vegan fast-food restaurant here>. :D

Erik

[Erin Pavlina]

When the waiter comes to our table and gets ready to list the specials I interrupt (sometimes) and say, "If any of the specials you're about to name contain meat or dairy products, you can just skip those as we're strict vegetarians."

Sometimes we just let them finish. Don't want to break his stride, ya know?

[Shayla]

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Mystican
I don't want to act grossed out or say "ewwww" (even though I feel like doing that) because I don't want to seem rude or "intolerant." :mad: Well WHY DO WE ALWAYS HAVE TO BE THE TOLERANT ONES?!?

Ah, yes. Intolerance. The pet hate of all pet hates. My first vegan Thanksgiving all I heard was how gross and tasteless my food was. Even though nobody thought to try it. Say that about someone's turkey and you'll have a Grandma in tears.

A little anecdote: A distant cousin I haven't seen for ten years had a huge outburst about how "sick" it was that we were vegan, and that we were just "freaks". My mom just sat there all smug that someone finally agreed with her POV on the matter. I later asked my mom how she could let someone who was practically a stranger verbally attack me (esp. in my parents' own house) and she said, "Well, you'll have to get used to it. It's a consequence of your choice. You should expect that, because that's what people think of the vegan thing." I don't think I have to explain to you just how wrong that statement is on so many levels.

About 80 percent of my husband's co-workers are in the "beef" industry, complete with "beef" license plates. He got harrassed so much, he finally just started coming back with, "I'm not trying to make you eat vegetarian, so why are you trying to make me eat meat?" I just feel like being vegan does not automatically void the basic rules of society when it comes to interaction. Apparently, most of the non-vegan world does not agree.

Okay, that was my little rant.

Another pet hate is when people ask, "Can you eat such and such?" The "can" is what bothers me. I get this all the time. Veganism is not being inflicted on me, people. It's a choice. So, yeah, I can eat it. But I won't.

Okay, so I had another, smaller rant. Hmm. I'm not usually so "ranty". Next time I'll be more pleasant. :)

Shayla

[Erin Pavlina]

It took my mother about 2 years to stop offering me tuna.

Mom: "Here, have some tuna. Oh wait, you can't have that can you?"

I also get people who say, "I don't like vegan food." And I'm like, "Oh, so you don't eat fruits or vegetables then?" And they say, "Huh?" And I say, "Fruits and vegetables are vegan." And they're like, "Oh, well I meant, you know, the weird stuff."

[reb_granger]

What really gets on my nerves? The way some people go on and on about 'humane slaughter'. I've had people chiding me for being vegetarian, because my dietary choice does not support 'humanely'-operating animal farms.

Excuse me. Isn't it all the more cruel to forcefully take the life of a happy, healthy animal (assuming that humanely-reared animals are happy and healthy)?

[sophie]

Another thing I hate (holiday season has reminded me of this) is when you go to a gathering or pot-luck and everyone has to bring a plate, and you bring two just to be sure you won't starve, and you make some lentil patties as everyone is having a barbeque, and when you go to eat one they're nearly all gone, and all these meat-eating people are saying "oh yeah, I tried some of your lentil burgers, they were nice", and you're glad they liked them and all but all your food has disappeared and you're HUNGRY!!!!!

[Erin Pavlina]

Oh yeah, totally Sophie!

I was working at this place once and they brought in pizza for everyone for a big staff meeting. They ordered me a veggie cheeseless pizza. Everyone else ordered pepperoni and ham and pineapple, etc. But when they entered the room, everyone was grabbing for my cheeseless veggie pizza! If I wasn't quick, I wouldn't have gotten any. the pepperoni sat completely undisturbed.

The woman who had taken everyone's orders started yelling at the people taking the veggie pizza saying, "Hey tha'ts for Erin and Derek (lactose intolerant). Stop eating their pizza and eat what you ordered!" People were saying, "I know I said I wanted pepperoni, but the veggie one looked so much better."

Oy vey!

[alexis]

Here's a winner, it's from my mom after witnessing a blow-up from my pre-teen veg sister: "you're going crazy because you don't eat meat. That's what happens to people who don't eat meat." So um....what about my hindu or buddhist friends who are veg???

[lijahbaby]

Hi all! I just noticed this thread and thought I'd chime in.
When I first became vegan a few months ago I was talking to my sisters boyfriend about it and he told me that he knew some people who called themselves "vegans" but they occasionaly hunted,killed,and ate animals that they caught themselves in the woods. I found that very disturbing.And this weekend I was watching t.v and there was this woman from some show being interviewed.She was talking about her healthy vegetarian diet and in the same sentence she said she only ate fish and organic chicken that was humanely killed(oxymoron).I wanted to smack the t.v! No wonder there is so much confusion about what's veggie and what's not!

[reb_granger]

Yeah lijahbaby, such people drive me mad too! How grossly they misrepresent vegetarianism, and the values held by vegetarians!

Alexis, when I gave up milk, my mum routinely complained that I was becoming bad-tempered because there was no milk in my body. "Look at the cow," she screamed dramatically (there was no cow to look at, by the way). "See how gentle and patient the cow is! That's because cows drink milk!"

And I seriously had no idea that cows do not drink milk, only calves do. :)

[alexis]

reb, well you should probably tell your mom that cows only drink milk as calves and even that's milk from their OWN species....:p

but seriously, i think non-vegans are really weird....i read a magazine which said Madonna put her kid on a macrobiotic diet which contains no diary or meat and some people they interviewed seemed to have this impression that she's depriving her kid by not allowing her to eat sugar and chemical laden foods.....hmmmmm.....if only MY mom did this to me as a kid....maybe i wouldn't have a regular 'diet' of sinusitis medication and what not...;)