peta

[GoodLuck_Jman]

who here has been to the peta web site? i found it personally disterbing. it wasnt the film or the stories that were disturbing, but it was the facts. did anyone else knowtes that the facts didnt even have the same number for the same thing. ie the number of animals killed for americans each year said 10 million and 25 million. on there web site, it said that you should not drink milk from cows that have used rBST, they mention that in European Union and astraila that it is ban. after doing some studing i found out that the real reason that they baned it was because they have a milk surplus, and dont want it to increase the surplus. 75% of all the milk prodused in the European union is ceased by the goverment to increase the cost of milk to a level of some compition. they say that it also causes the utters to become so big that they drag on the ground. my family grew up on a farm, and they say that that is completly natural for them to have that if they arent milked, and it happens almost every time they have a caf. they say that they treat the animals so badly that they cant walk went they reach the sluater house. i have 3 problems with this. the FDA will not exept any animal that can not walk on its own when it reaches the sluater house. and number two is that most cows weigh upwords of 600 pounds. a man can not lift a cow of that weight on his own. my other problem with that is that most farms try very hard to keep the animals under as little stress and as movable as possible. if it is under little stress then it will taste much better then those that have lived a life of stress. if the cow is movable, it will also put on more muscil, not fat. fat is normally cut off, and is daed weight. please look into what you read. i will normally do a search on anything at all that seams a little off.
jason

[sarahrose]

I'm sorry, but you live in a fantasy land! Cows who cannot walk on their own (downers) are slaughtered all the time. I have seen this and know that it is true. true, a man cannot lift a 600lb cow; that is why they are dragged with chaines attached to a truck, which I have also seen. Due to the recent mad cow cases, Downers are now not allowed into the food supply, because the inability to walk is a symptom of mad cow. This ban on downers is completely new, literally last week this came into effect. Also, Bovine Growth Hormone, which is banned in the U.K was banned because not only is it extremely cruel to the cow, but it is dangerous to humans; it just has not yet been banned here , but I'm sure it will be soon. The differences in numbers of animals slaughtered was most likely different animals. For instance, 25 million cows, 10 million pigs, ect.... PETA cannot afford to have wrong information on their site: People research their facts all the time. In fact, mostly all of their facts come from govornment sources, like the USDA, FDA ect. Also, there is a surplus of milk, here and everywhere. One of the reasons "farmers" began using BGH was because the govornment has a contract to buy all surplus milk, originally to cover gaps in the market. But, the "farmers" got greedy, hence the use of BGH. Now, there is more milk, dried and in storage, than the entire world could use for hundreds of years without ever running out! That is why literally every school lunch is overflowing with dairy-to try to use some of it up!
P.S. two words: spell check.....most computers have it, and it would make your writing a little more coherent.

[GoodLuck_Jman]

Finally, a vegan that will prove a point with evidence. Yes, my spelling is horrible, and I always forget to spell check. On the PETA web site it said exactly "every year in the U.S., more than 25 billion animals are slaughtered for food" and "10 billion animals are raised and killed every year in the United States". They switch back and forth on these numbers so much, that I don't think it would be a typing error as one of my friends said, and on some pages, it said both. And the story that i mentioned, the guy drags the dead cows on the floor by his hands all day. And he said that he could hear the bones break as it was dragged along. Now I am no expert on the human body, but only a few gifted men can drag 600 pounds of dead weight on cement. There are many things that I find odd about this organization.
Jason

[sarahrose]

Wow, it must be a strong man who can drag 600lbs of limp, downed cow. I have only seen cows being dragged either by chaines looped around their hind legs, or hooks (to gruesome for words) Usually their legs break in the process, but i have never seen a person actually drag one by hand. Alot of people thought that downed cows were not allowed into the food supply, so don't feel bad. Only since the ban have people really been aware. Most people are like, " a ban on downed cows in the food supply? I did not know they were in the food supply in the first place!" But, if you have ever eaten at Mc. Donald's, you have most likely eaten a downed cow at one time or another. A girl I know used to have the job of collecting downed dairy cows and transporting them to the slaughter house where Mc. Donalds gets their meat. They pay the farmers $30 per downed cow. No wonder they can sell a burger for less than a buck! I do apologise for the comment about your spelling- sometimes you think a thing light-heartedly and then look back at it in writing and it sounds cruel.
You know, alot of people have a problem with PETA. They are very controvertial, and always will be. It just boils down to what you choose to believe. One thing I can tell you though is that usually PETA documents things on video, so you can watch and hear it for yourself. No need to take someone's word for it at all. If the facts on the web site don't make sense to you, you can always just see it with your own eyes. Go to the 'meet your meat' video on their web site, or to the media section to watch any other videos they have. But don't do it if you are easily depressed, have a weak stomach, or have sleeping problems.
P.S. again; the 25B and 10B numbers you mentioned sound alot like the numbers for : 25B slaughtered for food 10B slaughtered for fur. I cannot be sure-that is just from memory, so don't quote me on it.

[Casey]

sarahrose is right - PETA is very controversial and you may not always agree with their tactics, but they are generally quite accurate with their facts. I went to the PETA site to find an explanation for the 25 billion/10 billion animal discrepancy, and here's what I found:

26 billion = number of animals killed for food in the U.S. alone each year (9 billion land-based, 17 billion aquatic)

Hopefully that straightens out the facts and I'm sure you, GoodLuck_Jman, didn't literally mean that you found the perceived factual inaccuracy more disturbing than the PETA videos or stories - I don't know anyone who can watch those videos and not be sick to their stomachs.

[sarahrose]

What you said about the videos making you sick is so true. The first time I saw a baby pig picked up by it's feet, swung in the air and then smashed on the floor, all while screaming in terror, I got dizzy and nearly had a panic attack. The thing I just mentioned, by the way, is completely legal and acceptable to the USDA. Yes, it's all very disturbing. I also hate seeing them being shot in the head with bolt guns- it's very unpleasant.

[Casey]

I've had the same reaction as you described. You hear all these facts and statistics, but sometimes you have to see the actual living creatures suffering such unbearable cruelty before you really get it. PETA (www.petatv.com) has another video called "Puppies in the Kill Box" - if people can treat "man's best friend" like that, then what chance do animals that are "just food" stand?

This might not be the right forum for this, but on a personal note, it was PETA's "Meet your Meat" video that finally convinced my husband to become vegetarian - so I'm very much in support of the work they do.

[StevenMozart]

I've been a member of PETA for almost two years now. I hope that isn't held against me, because I would've defended them long before I joined. The reasons are following:
a) My mother works for another non-profit organization, and with research I've found out that PETA is very efficient financially. That is, they spend more money on actual programs to help animals (and people really, if they adopt healthier diets) than they do on say, sending out countless envelopes to people who've donated before, as the Humane Society tends to do. When I give money to a charity, for animals or for humans, I check to see that they put it to good use, or at the very least, to the use for which I intended it with my heart.
b) Skewed facts are irrelevant in this case, if they are justified by the ends. If two Americans every year decide to 'go veg' after witnessing a PETA protest or seeing some propagandist sticker I've put someplace (because propaganda isn't necessarilly untrue), or by just looking around peta-online.org, that's two more healthier people. That's two people who showed a little compassion. That's two more people that won't fit into the stereotypes that embarrass citizens of the US like me.

There are more reasons, but to reply to what has been said by you all:

Dates are important when looking at PETA online or paper publications. For instance, the Caring Consumer Guide, that lists companies that don't test their products on animals, etc. is updated every year. Aside from things like that, information that they get from government agencies is also constantly changing. If you've ever looked around your library and found that desolate section filled with tax forms, scientific magazines from the 1950s, Congressional reports, and the like, you know that facts and figures change rapidly--even those concerning animal rights.

... and you know, if PETA writers are simply spewing numbers significant to them because of numerology or something like that... I really don't mind. They do a lot for animals (including our pets), they do a lot for vegetarians and vegans, and they do a lot to make people (even those that don't fact check) think.

[sarahrose]

Steve, you are right about their efficiency. While I have some issues with PETA, on a whole I support them. No one group does more for the animals. I remember this anti-PETA guy ranting about those greedy PETA employees, and said that if they were really putting all the money toward animals, then how come they drive such fancy cars. He was referring to one PETA employee driving a honda hybrid. I laughed at that. I had never heard a honda be called fancy before! When I pointed out the annual review financial statement that showed that the PETA salaries equalled something like 1-3% total, he said that that would still add up to alot! Some people are so clueless.

[PikkuMyy]

What is this doing in vegan teens, anyway?

[QUEEEEENIE]

I am a proud member of PETA, and I post on the PETA2 boards, and just joined VegFamily to use these boards, etc. I think that a lot people judge PETA and carry common misconeptions about PETA without really getting to know the organisation and the people who work for it.

What it comes down to is that PETA is the biggest animal rights organisation in the entire world. They have the most funds, they have the most celebrities and other big names on their side, they do the most leafleting, they change the most minds, etc. Basically, they are doing the most for animals. They're not asking for you to agree with all of their information or the way they work, they're just asking you to help out and respect animals. I think a lot of you would be surprised at the amount of stuff they do, and the amount of stuff they allow you to do (table at big shows like Warped Tour, etc.), go on big protests for like Huntington LIfe Sciences, etc. and the PETA2 boards are great! You guys should all thoroughly check PETA out before you make a decision.

[ILoveTheUsed]

Okay, even if Peta is right or wrong or any of your facts are right or wrong the main point is NOT eating innocent animals that dont deserve to be killed. We can survive without meat. Goto Peta2.com and find somewhere where you can view videos and click The Used Quinn Allman or whatever, what he has to say is totally true. If you want to veiw the video and need help finding it..email or IM me...

but seriously people STOP arguing on whos facts are right or wrong the pain point of being Vegatarian..Vegan..whatever is NOT EATING HELPLESS INNOCENT ANIMALS!! that feel all that pain. and its gross. you wouldnt eat a cat would you?? theres no diffrence on eating a cow. they both have feelings and actully people do eat cats..soo theres no diffrence. right??

[horsesarentfood]

dude! I have been to the peta website and was gonna join but like yeah some of the things that peta members are against are kinda not cool... Alot of the "cruelty to cows" is way overrated not everyone is mean to them. I live on a farm and we have dairy and beef cows.(..MY dad isnt a vegitarian..) And yeah not everone is mean to them... I agree with you.. Not all there facts are accurate.

[kjmckenzie]

But even if not all people are mean to cows and other animals, don't you think that PETA still needs to bring it to people's attention that there are animals out there being treated badly?

Also, it depends on what you mean being treated badly is. To me, a cow having to be hooked up to machines that pump her teats whether she is sore or not, after having her baby taken away from her is cruel. A cow being killed also is being treated badly in my mind no matter how much pasture they had in their lifetime.

And the fact is that with all the dairy milk and beef consumption in the world (and especially in North America), there is alot of what I feel to be cruel treatment of cows, going on.

[Starry]

Yeah, PETA really loves animals...if your definition of 'animal' doesn't include a pit bull (funny, seems to have all the qualifications to me--right kingdom, motile, has central nervous system, can feel pain and terror and devotion to its family...). I will not support any organization that promotes a blanket policy for pit bull euthanasia in animal shelters. It is cruel, hysteriacal, NIMBY nonsense. And the fact that Ingrid Newkirk (co-founder of PETA) supports this policy with "reluctance" means jack to the poor creatures slaughtered without a chance to be adopted into loving homes.

"People who genuinely care about dogs won't be affected by a ban on pit- bull breeding. They can go to the shelter and save one of the countless other breeds and lovable mutts sitting on death row. " ~~Ingrid Newkirk

Maybe we don't care about the ban on pit bull breeding (assuming all dogs are included--breed specific legislation is nonsense, as demonstrated by more than a few children who have been mauled to death by toy breeds), but I think a few of us who genuinely care about dogs are affected by the idea that a pit bull will be killed without a second thought the moment it enters an animal shelter. Many of us are 'affected' by the fact that these policies usually go hand in hand with outright breed bans, forcing many thousands of wonderful pets to be turned over to be murdered.

How very vegan of PETA. Not.

http://www.nokillnow.com/PETAkillPitbulls.php

As for it being okay PETA to fudge the facts...sorry, no. The ends to not justify the means. Honesty and honor are still important, last time I checked. Propaganda is the last refuge of someone who can't assemble all the facts. I don't need some extremist group to tell me to eat vegan. I made that choice through reason and intelligent thought. And PETA alienates more people than it converts, IMO. If no one takes you seriously, how many people can you convince? Maybe they should spend less money making fun of children who were ripped apart by sharks (nice billboards all that donation money funded--how many spay/neuter programs could that have benefitted?) and more money researching/publishing the health benefits of veganism.

[liblady1]

I'll bet you did not grow up on a FACTORY FARM, did you?

The cows wouldn't have calves in the first place if they weren't artificially inseminated and KEPT pregnant most of their lives.

What it says on the FDA website is completely different from the rules that are enforced, as well as how strictly they are enforced.

Most animals are not raised on farms, they are raised on FACTORY farms, which are extremely stressful and horrific environments.

I don't think the stress level affects how the meat tastes, otherwise all Americans would be vegans.