Q for moms of boys

[Christa]

Following an experience we had yesterday, I am curious to hear from moms of boys as to whether you think that "playing" with animals (i.e. torturing animals) is "normal" boy behavior. Just briefly, dd got into it with some preteen boys at the park when they pulled a crodad out of the lake and were bending its tail back up against its body as well as having fished a small fish out of the same lake, put it in a bucket of water and kept taking it out and pulling its gills out (it was still alive).

Dd was "protesting." The mom of the boys told them to tell her to "back off." Dd wound up stealing the crodad away from them, being chased and finally managing to throw it back in the lake while they yanked her arm and scratched her. Their grandfather released the fish. The mother of the boys seemed to feel that what the boys were doing was fine and normal for boys and that my dd had the problem. I found it rather cruel.

I am curious if their behavior is normal for boys or rather an indication of a parent who allows such behavior and sees nothing wrong with it.

[wowmomx5]

It has been my experience as a Mom and remembering my childhood, that some kids seem to think it's o.k. and normal to torture animals. I can only assume that this comes from what they are taught is acceptable at home. I honestly would not be surprised if those boys were in some way neglected or abused themselves.

I don't think any of my kids have had quite an encounter. You should be really proud of your dd. That was great what she did. And BRAVE!

In our house I teach/model to enjoy nature and animals in their own environment. I don't think my kids would dream of harming any animal, but they have been known to bring home grasshoppers in jars etc. I simply reverse the circumstance (how would you feel if a creature much larger than you and higher up on the food chain, captured you and put you in a glass jar and threw you a couple of crackers?) and then they are more than ready to let them go. I don't mind if they keep it for a few minutes, just to observe and learn, but that's it, just a FEW minutes.

Again, great job by your little one!

[vegma]

My son is 7 and he would be very upset if he witnessed someone doing that!

I'm impressed that your dd spoke up and made such a daring rescue!

I've read that children that abuse animals often grow up to abuse people.

[veganloraine]

my ds is 5 and he's the most compassionate little man and i think it has a lot to do with the fact that he's highly sensitive and he's been shown that all creatures deserve to be treated with respect. several times on the playground while waiting for class to start he's run to me with tears because the other children, boys and girls, are squishing worms on the asphalt. their parents (and the teacher) could care less that they're torturing another life and it's up to me and him to try and talk sense into them.

i don't understand why parents don't see teaching compassion as part of their duty when raising their children - like teaching them to look both ways when crossing the street. can you imagine what the world would be like. *shivers*

[veganloraine]

oh, and your daughter is incredible and i hope she never looses her voice. i remember when i was 12 and watching boys strap firecrackers to frogs and turtles and blow them up and i didn't have the courage to say anything, i just left the scene. it still haunts me today and i just turned 35 (ack).

[mamaoftofuboy]

I don't believe that there is such a thing as boy behavior and girl behavior. I truly believe that it is a socially constructed label to let boys get away with doing things differently and keeping both sexes in gender defined boxes.

I know plenty of boys, both young and old, that do not fit, nor ever have fit, the stereotype of the rough and tumble boy. My almost 3 year old son doesn't fit this stereotype either (we also haven't let him watch violent cartoons, play with guns, or witness or engage in violent play). He is a sweet, loving, creative, smart, kid.

I know many people believe that this exists but honestly do we think that boys know how to play with guns and use violence upon exiting the womb and girls don't? No way! this is all learned behavior.

Your daughter's voice is strong and clear and I bet it will stay with at least one of those people for a long time to come.

[Christa]

Originally Posted by veganloraine

oh, and your daughter is incredible and i hope she never looses her voice.

Thanks everyone.

I suspect that dd is so outspoken that she is unlikely to become someone who lets things go by. She also has the role model at home (me) who tends to speak up when wrongs occur. Unfortunately for both of us, we are both extremely sensitive as well as having a huge need to not let wrongs occur so we wind up speaking out and then suffering tremendously emotionally from the negative reactions we get from others.

[kjmckenzie]

I am having an issue with my 2 year old son about bugs. Apparently, his baby-sitter (who is wonderful and supportive of our eating vegan) kills bugs and so my son has taken to stomping on bugs. I have talked to him about it and told him it hurts the bugs and gives them an "owie" so we'll see, but he goes to her house once a week and I don't feel comfortable telling her what to do at her own house.

Maybe I should plant some bugs in our house that I can rescue while she is here so that I show her how we deal with bugs without having to make her lose face...hmmm. And if my son agrees not to hurt bugs it will be difficult for him to see his baby-sitter who he adores hurting bugs. Arg.

[Christa]

I do have to admit that babysitters have an influence. I used to babysit for my neighbor's dd when I was a teen. The mom, also, squished bugs, but I did not. I remember giving the little girl a bath one night when she was 2 or 3 and there was a spider in the tub. She looked at the bug, looked at me, and then said, "pick it up and take it outside."

[veganloraine]

when my oldest ds was about 2ish he was stung by a bee at his babysitter/grandparent's house and they killed every single bee in the nest in retaliation, which is not the message i would have wanted sent. however, this weekend at the cottage he has declared "daddy long-legs" as his new favourite insect. there is hope! kids can learn to love insects and treat them with kindness.

[edamommy]

INSAne! I just think it's so awful that parents allow their children to expirament on live beings! Sickening!

My ds is 4 and has had several of these run-ins. Wether it's "hunting for ants", just to kill them. Or trapping bees and trying to pull wings off w/o being stung... my ds isn't okay with it. And he told the (older) playmates this and also told them he was going in side and if they wanted to play something NICER they could come get him!

[VegParent]

Torture of animals is a sociopathic behavior. It is definately not "boy" behavior, but rather a sign of the person's emotional disturbance. It makes me so sad that your dd had to be the voice of reason to that situation and that the boy's parents sat by and watched. Obviously, those boys were doing things that were condoned by their parents - which speaks volumes about the parents.

Also, I'd be so proud of my dd if she had the confidence to stand up for her beliefs. Bravo to her! My oldest is 3 1/2 now and hasn't had to make those kinds of decisions, yet. I hope I can instill the confidence in her to do the same.
Amber

[celtic-womble]

It's not cool but it's hardly sociopathic behavior! Sure if the kids are blowing up cats or kicking dogs off cliffs but a kid stomping on a bug doesn't mean they're going to grow in to a serial killer!

I remember when I was little I liked to run around stamping on butterflies. I had no idea that it hurt them or that it killed them, jumping on them was just like playing hopscotch or tag with really small targets. When my husband was a kid he once killed a frog by poking it repeatedly with a toothpick. Yes it's horrible but to his child mind it was just scientific inquiry. He periodically mentions it and tells me how guilty he feels. He's now that guy that will pull over and help little creatures to the side of the road so they don't get squished.

If I see my DS trying anything like that (he was chasing ants the other day) I tell him it's not cool and ask how he would like it. He's still a bit young to really get it (as evidenced by the fact that he will sometimes do the same thing a couple of days later) but he stops at the time and says "sorry bug" then goes off to do something else.

[Lazurii]

My son is only 17 months old, but he never acts maliciously towards animals. He does conduct "science experiments," but we gently redirect him, reminding him that he's hurting the animal.

I'm proud of your daughter! She must have wonderful parents.